when they lost "lost" the shutdown of 1995 and 1996 they emerged -- yes, they still impeached bill clinton, but they were a slightly more reasonable party in terms of reaching compromises on other issues with clinton from that point forward. >> let me ask you. if they're just threatening a downgrade, again, what is your view on how bad that is for the u.s. economy? ? i mean, there are lots of perilous things that will kick into place. >> in the short-term, sadly, perversely not so bad. >> right. >> i don't think it's going to have a huge impact on -- short-term. the question is it's a long-term thing, and that's two, three, four, five, ten years out, and that's what you are fighting against. yeah, short-term, i don't think anyone will care. >> nobody goes to fish to decide -- >> why do they rate treasuries? go, fitch. go away, s&p. we know what the interest rates are. that's how people think of debt. >> what we are capable of, and are we -- >> pa what our standing should be and what our rating should be. there's no question. i don't think in the short-term we have any -- and, sadly, that g